I gather that you went to school for voice?
Yeah, jazz vocals.
When did you first start getting into recording?
The first time I actually went to a studio was when my dad took me. I was 13 or 14. When I moved to Seattle from Hawaii, I wrote my first song within the first couple of weeks I was here. A complete song. Verse, chorus, bridge; all complete to the end. I wrote it. Every time I read the lines, I could remember how the melody went. I'd been telling my family I wanted to do music. My dad was trying to get me into acting, because I was doing Shakespeare when I was younger. When I was around 13 or 14, he was doing something with KCTS [public television]. He was one of the producers of this little show that only had a couple of episodes called Dig It. They needed some kid extras, so he found a way for me to be in it. The people who did the song for it had a studio, and my dad wanted to introduce me to them. He thought perhaps I could learn something from them. I was like, "Oh, my god; I'm in a studio. Look at this stuff!" The first time I went to record in the studio, I think I was 16 or something, and it was with my choir in high school. That was weird; I did my first solo, which got cut because they didn't like it. They didn't tell me; I found out when I heard the CD. Really getting into studio was when I was in college. I first started tinkering around with GarageBand and trying to record ideas. Mostly I was vocalizing, because I wasn't really comfortable with instrumentation or how to record it, but I knew I could just sing into my black MacBook.
The little built-in mic?
Yeah. That was the first time I experimented. I tried all these programs until I got to Ableton Live, which was really my comfort zone.
Is that the one that opened up for you, as far as composing?
Before I tried to use Finale, because I was trying to chart songs. That's what they taught me when I was studying as a jazz vocalist. They want you to do charts. That was the only audio workspace that I knew.
Where it's a mock-up of the charts?
Yeah, totally. You play it and it charts everything for you. It's so hard.
It doesn't sound musical, a lot of the time. It plays samples where the notes are.
Yeah. Especially if I'm uncomfortable with some of it. "How long is this note? Is it a quarter note? Eighth note?" That was the first time I even did anything with something similar to a DAW before I got into GarageBand. Ableton was the most challenging, and the most comforting at the same time. I tried working with [Propellerhead Software's] Reason. I liked the drum sequencer, because it felt so simple. "Just tweak this here and here." I loved the way it was formatted. That was really all that I liked though. The songs were complicated, and how to use it was weird. I liked Ableton because I was able to play tracks forever. When I first started using it, I made these weird 10-minute songs where I'd layer over it, and over and over again.
Because it's built to loop, it's like, "When does the song stop?"
Exactly. Before I was using it in Arrangement View, not Session View. Arrangement View is limitless, like Pro Tools. You're just running a track. It took me a couple of years to learn the Session View. It's challenging, but also exciting. Most people I was working with weren't working with Ableton, and when I asked people to teach me how to use programs, they didn't.
They didn't know?
I think they didn't know how to teach me, so they said, "No." My younger brother [Chocolate Chuck] made beats longer than I did. He helped me a lot in the beginning. He's been producing since he was 14. When I was getting into singing a couple of years later, he was focusing on DJing and producing. He was using FL Studio.
Formerly Fruity Loops.
Exactly. I've never tinkered with it.
It's like using an instrument, using one of these DAWs or programs. If I try to learn another one, it's going to take all this time. I want to be creative.
It's stressful. I spent so much time learning Ableton. I know the people at Ableton, and they support me. Ableton has all the functionality. Eventually I want to be able to do visuals triggered by my music. Even the idea of [Propellerhead Software's] ReWire, where you can bring in another DAW; wow, cool. That's why I love Ableton. They're pushing it. I got Pro Tools because it came with my first M-Audio interface. I was like, "Oh, sweet. What's an audio interface? What is Pro Tools?" When I was doing the early engineering for THEESatisfaction, we had a bootleg of Reason and this tiny, cute version of Pro Tools. Stasia ["Stas" Irons] was making all the beats in Reason. Then I'd record it into Pro Tools and mix it down with whatever I knew, which wasn't anything.
Were you two doing all of your own recording, editing, and mixing in that band?
We did for Snow Motion and That's Weird, our first mixtapes. I was mostly like, "Yo, we have to get it out." It's not even about sounding great; it's about trying it out, doing something new, and releasing it. I'm also like a control freak. "Let's just do it here. This sounds decent."
You've grown along the way too, as far as equipment and understanding about different audio interfaces, as well as the quality they bring, right?
Yeah. Right now I use a [Native Instruments] Komplete audio interface that was recommended to me by my friend King Britt. With THEESatisfaction, for a long time we didn't realize that you should have an audio interface if you're running something in a computer.
You'd plug into the 1/8-inch jacks on a computer?
Yes. First we were running it through iTunes. We had no idea, so we didn't even think to ask, "We've got gigs. Let's do it like this." We'd bounce out the tracks and put it in iTunes. Then we realized that iTunes has limiters built in that will disrupt your groove, and it won't make the best quality for a live performance. You only find that out from talking to people. Luckily, I made a lot of friends along the way. I had to put my ego aside and realize they aren't trying to insult me; rather they are truly trying to help me be a better artist. When King Britt recommended that Komplete [setup], we were on tour in Europe and we had a laptop. We kept hearing this "pop." It's because the 1/8-inch cable was jumping out of the jack because the bass was too bangin'. A friend of our agent's at the time was like, "You should use an audio interface." I had him break it down for me, and then I asked King Britt. I use it to record and perform. It's got six inputs. It has everything I need. I love the big knob volume control, because then I know what's going on. Instead of all these tiny ones where you might turn the wrong one.
Were you using that onstage last night?
Yeah. I use it all the time. I love Native Instruments, and I love how Ableton and Native Instruments work together; but it took a while to figure that out.
Did you get your set more flexible where you could hit pause and such?
Well, THEESatisfaction didn't really talk. We mostly danced around or did choreography. We didn't really touch the laptop at all. It was about movement and no talking - just performing. Now, with me, I run everything through Ableton Live. I trigger it, and I have live arrangements that I do. I rarely play anything directly live, because I'm still working on it. Last night I did. It was on my Roland.
Was that the little outboard controller you have going?
Yeah. I have a Roland keyboard on stage, a JD-Xi, and I've been recording songs into that. That was super fun.
What was the mix surface you were using?
I was doing some distortion on my Ableton Push 2; my other controller. I was mostly checking the levels and making sure levels weren't peaking. Some of those songs were so new that I hadn't really mixed them.
They hadn't really been "tracked," right?
Yeah. The backup vocals were so raw. Typically, I sing them one time, or however many times that day, and get the right one. I put on some reverb and delay, and that's good enough. But they're not always equal on both sides, or both sections of the song.
There's the recording and the creation of the song, they appear live on stage. The performing and tweaking of the song is all a flow and a process. It's not like this live show and the studio session are totally separate.
Yeah. I get really excited about songs. I have so many songs I've performed along the way where I just go, "Nah, I'm not feeling this anymore." I take them out, and then they're sitting there unfinished. I record a lot of my sets; I'll make up lyrics and get in the vibe. I see how it changes, and then, "Oh cool, I finally have the right lyrics for that." I need to remember how I sang it, so I can do it in the studio.
The common perception of someone performing solo with a computer on stage is that you hit a button and have to sing along with it. You're still in a flux of creativity. It's awesome to think of it that way.
Thanks. It's really interesting. I'm definitely still growing as an artist. I learn so much. I go to so many panels. I watch so many videos. I need to watch more YouTube tutorials. I have what I call my "Ableton gurus." I have people who work with all kinds of gear, and I can tell them, "Hey, I'm trying to loop these vocals. What would you suggest, in terms of gear, with your experience or your knowledge?" That's been awesome. I used to play tracks, but I want something different. I want to be able to do something more interactive. I studied acting; I can command the stage. It's not a big deal.
You seem really comfortable on stage.
