Todd Perlmutter

So many of people we talk to have a similar story to tell: they were in a band, built a studio, started recording local artists and made a few records that people noticed. The story of Todd Perlmutter might have started out in a similar way, drumming in bands in Boston and learning recording, but somehow he ended up as the Creative Director of Music and Sound for Blue Man Productions, Inc., the company behind the worldwide "creative organization" known as the Blue Man Group. Check out the interview at tapeop.com that I did with Todd a few years back about how he ended up with Blue Man and what he does. On this particular visit to BMG's LoHo Studios in NYC, we discussed Todd's entry into the realm of record labels — one with a specific recording agenda. Engineer Matt Werden, who works at Blue Man and has also engineered some of the projects for L.E.S. Records, also joined us.

When did the idea for a label germinate?

Chris Dyas (from The Lingering Doubts) was working on some music very slowly and he was kinda getting bummed out because members of his band were having kids and he couldn't hold them together. The material he was writing was unbelievable. I saw him play a few times and told him, "This is the best stuff you've ever written."

You'd played with him years ago?

I played with him 20 years ago in Orangutang. He was like, "Yeah, I know. I just can't get anyone motivated" and I said, "I'll come over and help you make your record." We picked a couple of nights a week; I went to his house and then he continued working on it. Sometime after that, I started playing with Greg Garing. My thing is that I always want to have a gig on New Year's. In New York it's really hard to get around that night — you have ten people with you and you can't get a cab. So I will find a gig. I will even put a band together in order to have a gig!

Why not?

It was already Christmas and a friend of mine said, "What are you doing on New Year's? I've got a gig and we need a drummer." I said, "Send me a song list and let me know." He said, "I don't think so... Just show up." I go to this club and I set up — the bass player's there, there's a horn player and then eventually, right before the set time, the singer [Greg Garing] sits down at the piano, doesn't even look at me, and just starts playing. We do three sets and Greg doesn't even talk to me. Not even a count-off.

Oh my god...

But it was awesome — his voice was great and he could play like crazy. The next week my friend said, "Hey, Greg wants to play with you again." And I said, "Really? Okay." I went and did another thing; this time it was a burlesque show. After three more sets we actually had a conversation. I finally realized it was the same guy that used to have a country show in the East Village ten years ago that I used to go to. So I started doing this show with him twice a month and, after a few months, we decided to finally have a rehearsal.

How strange.

I had the studio set up for a recording session. Matt Werden: I was here and it was 4 or 5 p.m. and Todd said, "Hey, what are you doing tonight? I need you to do a recording session." I asked, "What is it?" He said, "I'm not really sure."

See what happens.

We actually had a cool setup — I had the drums in the booth, a mic in the bigger booth and the upright bass player and the sax player out in the main room. I was like, "Let's be ready for anything." Greg showed us a song on the piano, a minute of it. Then he's checking the mic; I've got my headphones on and he counts it off. We start playing and he sings WAY loud. I realize, "I've got two choices: I can either stop and have him start again or I can just roll with it because it sounds awesome." We were going to tape, so I wasn't worried about the level. We'll get something out of it. That vocal ended up his final take and my drum take was the final. We started talking about making a record and I said, "I'll put a label together." He said to me, "I've had a lot of deals go bad and I'll never do a major label deal again, but if you put out my record I'll give you everything I've got." At that point I pushed it along and decided on doing the rest of Chris' record here. It took a while; it was piecemeal, but for Greg's record every first vocal was his final vocal.

Greg's record feels so "live."

There's one, "All About You," where we recorded drums, vocals and sax. His vocal take was great and the sax solo was awesome, but the form was really shady. There was no bass or rhythm guitar, or anything to hold it down. I tried putting a bass down and it made it sound weird. I couldn't get the form right. Eventually we got an organ player to listen to it and figure out how to fit in the holes of the song.

What was the impetus to use tape that day, and to continue with it from then on?

When I started recording stuff, there was only tape. Even when I started working for Blue Man, the first Blue Man record we did to tape; two 24-tracks locked up. I was still doing the engineering when we switched to Pro Tools; and then my job got very complicated and convoluted. I hired Matt as my intern and, coming right out of school, he was far more sophisticated in his knowledge of Pro Tools than I was. I was still using it as a tape machine and figuring out how to not lose shit. From that point I kind of stepped back from engineering. Since then, Matt's become the Chief Engineer here. When it came time for this project I was missing the parts of recording where you have to get the take. I figured out what I don't like about records is I don't feel like it's a piece of time; a recording of a "thing that happened at this time." And people fixing things... It's not a bad thing; it just leaves artists thinking, "Oh, I sang that a little flat. Let me sing that word again." That's fine — that is modern recording. However when I started the label, I thought, "One thing I can do is to be dedicated to grabbing performances."

There should be some kind of focus to the label and, knowing you, your taste is pretty wide. You like all kinds of things.

Just between those two records — they're so different. Greg's got this country/Americana kind of vibe, but it's this performance. And then Chris has got these fantastically composed songs with amazing lyrics. There's definitely a little more tracking and conceptualizing involved on Chris' record.

Oh, absolutely.

But they both have performances and they both benefited from being forced to land on tape. A bunch of Chris' stuff was 8-track and we were kind of going back and forth...

So some is 8-track at home and some is 24-track done here?

We would record a track here. We did the drum track [for a song] here; he took it home and put it on his 8-track and then layered all this other stuff on. Then he asked, "Should we dump it to 24-track?" There were a couple of times when he wanted to put one or two more things on it and I said, "No. Let's mix from the 8-track!" Being forced to do that was cool. Some of my favorite recordings, Led Zeppelin and The Kinks, if those records were made today, some of the charm would go away.

"Double everything!"

We had a trombone player that played on Chris' record. I had two tracks for him. He did a solo and said, "Let me do another one. " He did another one and was like, "Well, I liked a piece of this one. Let me run about six or seven more." I said, "No. That's it, you're done." He asked, "What do you mean?" He'd never even seen a tape machine!

Did you mix down to 1/4-inch tape after you did all the tracking?

We had been mixing all our music, even the Blue Man stuff, to 1/4-inch for a while. Everything sounded better going through our MCI, once we got that working.

Where did you master it?

We did it with Scott Hull; he did a really good job.

What's in the future for the label?

I've got a couple things coming up. It's pretty slow going. I do have a day job. Chris is working on a second record; he has some stuff already. I want to get a touring band. You know, [a band] that's in the van, out there playing shows and needs somebody to make them an awesome record. I'm in no massive rush. I'm not going to make anything I don't like...

What projects are keeping you busy with Blue Man right now?

Blue Man is cramming right now. The Las Vegas and Orlando shows are getting a whole bunch of new material. We've been doing a lot of weird gigs. There's a lot of development going on right now. And radio and TV commercials — we do a lot of that stuff.

Read a previous interview we did with Todd about Blue Man and his career online at tapeop. com. www. lesrecs. com, www. blueman. com